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OSC Record Holder |
Read the entire article here on the KC Star website
How stadiums, sports can affect life for us in KC By JEFFREY SPIVAK The Kansas City Star Bet you didn't know having the Royals and Chiefs in fixed-up stadiums may put extra money in your pockets. Or that the stadiums' operations may actually sap jobs out of the local economy. That may not make sense, but those are some of the ways Kansas City's major-league sports and their stadiums affect your life, whether you are a sports fan or not. At least that is what the experts say. Economic impacts of pro sports are a highly controversial subject. All across the country, city consulting studies claim that teams and their newer stadiums generate lots of income and jobs. Yet most economists who have studied the issue are just as adamant that they don't "” and may not even outweigh the costs to taxpayers. Next month, Jackson County residents will get to decide, in two ballot measures, whether a total of $777 million should be invested in the Truman Sports Complex. One measure calls for renovating Kauffman and Arrowhead stadiums to make them state of the art. The other measure proposes adding a rolling roof over those stadiums to help attract big-time events like a Super Bowl. Is that investment worth the economic returns to the community? Stadium work poses risks for rewards Do votes for stadium renovations and a rolling roof on April 4 make sense economically for the metropolitan area? The Kansas City Star breaks down that question into four pieces. – Do the stadiums and the teams playing there make you richer? Maybe, but it might be hard to notice. A new study done for the Greater Kansas City Chamber of Commerce predicts the stadium renovations, once completed, will trigger $412 million in economic activity for Jackson County every year. That is not all new activity, because the teams are already there, but it represents the loss if the teams leave, which would concern the chamber if voters don't approve the stadium renovations. So the economic figure adds up everything from team payrolls to team memorabilia sales, from business at sports bars to business at grocery stores related to game-watching parties. As part of that impact, the study by consulting firm Development Strategies Inc. of St. Louis suggests total personal income of county residents would be $73 million higher because of the stadiums' operations and fans' spending. That figure means having the teams play in fixed-up stadiums would put, on average, $111 in the pocket of every county resident. To better understand how this would happen, consider Chiefs season ticket-holder Phil Pulley. He is from Arkansas, and so for every Chiefs home game, he and his family and friends fly to Kansas City in a private jet, rent a car, stay at a hotel, go out to eat, buy groceries for tailgating and, of course, go to the game. All told, Pulley estimates he spends more than $3,700 every Chiefs weekend. That helps pay the salaries at those businesses, then those workers have money to buy things, and there is a continued trickle-down through the economy. "If you live in Jackson County, it's hard to see this, but on the outside looking in, it's easy to see," said Pulley, chief executive of a lawn-mower manufacturing company. However, many economists say that is just one side of the story. A growing legion of academic and financial researchers have asserted that such impact studies measure only the positive benefits of stadium-related spending. In fact, there are costs associated with that spending and even economic losses that result. For example, the additional 3/8 -cent sales tax to fund the stadium renovations would end up costing the typical Jackson County consumer about $25 a year, based on federal data on spending in the metropolitan area. That would reduce the county income projection. In addition, when residents spend money on sports, they are choosing not to go to the theater, gambling boats or fancy restaurants. "The more people spend at restaurants and nightclubs located near a stadium, the less they may spend at restaurants and nightclubs located elsewhere," economists Jordan Rappaport and Chad Wilkerson wrote in a report for the Federal Reserve Bank of Kansas City. In effect, the economists believe, sports facilities result in little overall net income growth in a community. Even the author of the Kansas City chamber study acknowledges this. But a consultant for Kansas City's new arena, Bob Herrfeldt of Horrow Sports Ventures, noted: "At the end of the day, there's not an economic benefit of a library, either, but that doesn't stop communities from doing them." – Do the businesses of baseball and football at the sports complex expand the local economy's job base? Short term, yes. Long term, probably not so much. On the one hand, the study for the Kansas City chamber claims the stadium renovations would result in 2,420 new jobs in construction and related positions. And once that was done, the stadiums and teams would generate 3,260 jobs in Jackson County, ranging from ones that already exist like ballplayers and hotel workers across the street, to possible new ones like restaurant waitresses. "The number of jobs is comparable to the creation of Embarq, the spin-off company from Sprint Nextel, and that translates to the presence of a major employer in Kansas City," said Pete Levi, the chamber's president. Miguel Meneses, president of the Hispanic Chamber of Commerce of Greater Kansas City, said he believed his members would feel that impact. "They (the teams and stadiums) open opportunities for employment, both on the construction side and outside that, from the maintenance crews to catering," he said. However, Brad Furnish, an opponent of the stadiums referendum, claims the job projections are inflated. Furnish, who has a master's degree in economics and has taught economics classes at local colleges, takes issue with the way the study uses an economic multiplier, a way of estimating how many jobs are created throughout the economy. He says a multiplier should not be applied when an economy is humming along as it is in Kansas City with very little unemployment, a condition that slows job creation. "If someone submitted this study in an undergraduate economics class, it should get an ˜F'," Furnish said. Academic economists have studied this issue even further. Dennis Coates from the University of Maryland, Baltimore, and Brad Humphreys at the University of Illinois tried to estimate the effect of pro sports on the retail and services sectors of local economies. They found in most metropolitan areas, having sports teams resulted in fewer retail and service jobs. The impact was particularly negative in Kansas City, where they estimated thousands of jobs were sapped from the economy because of spending on sports. In an interview with The Star, Coates speculated that Kansas City may be so hard-hit because there is not a lot of entertainment alternatives besides sports, so residents devote a larger proportion of leisure dollars to the sports teams. If spent elsewhere, that money would create more jobs because it would stay more in the local economy. Certainly the history of the stadiums so far shows they have not spawned much direct development around them. – Are there other benefits to having the teams and stadiums in Kansas City? Certainly, in many unrecognized ways. While the economic benefits of sports teams and stadiums are debatable, another benefit is not: How sports teams add to a community's quality of life. Even academic economists recognize this. The quality-of-life benefits take many forms "” residents attending games, listening to games on radio, hosting parties to watch games on television, talking about games with co-workers, even second-guessing games on talk radio. A Florida court case over Tampa Bay's football stadium funding led that state's Supreme Court to describe these intangible benefits: "The court finds that the Buccaneers instill civic pride and camaraderie into the community and that Buccaneer games and other stadium events also serve a commendable public purpose by enhancing the community image on a nationwide basis." Lee's Summit entrepreneur Jo Anne Gabbert appreciates this. "We don't have mountains for skiing, not the ocean or beach for recreational activity. But we do have major-league sports," said Gabbert, who runs a management consulting business. "We need to be a major-league city or we stand to lose jobs and companies to other cities that do have major-league sports and other cultural benefits." Bob Marcusse, the metropolitan area's chief business recruiter, can attest to that, too. Business site selectors he works with look at a metropolitan area's population, growth, cost-of-living, plus whether its quality of life can help recruit talented workers. "Kansas City is often given an opportunity to compete because it is perceived as a major-league city," said Marcusse, president of the Kansas City Area Development Council. However, the benefit of being major-league has been difficult to quantify, in dollar terms. Among the researchers who have tried are economist Jerry Carlino of the Federal Reserve Bank of Philadelphia and economics professor Ed Coulson of Penn State University. In their study of NFL cities that gained or lost a franchise in the 1990s, they found the presence of a team raised housing rents by 8 percent, after controlling for other economic changes. In an interview with The Star, though, Carlino noted that such an effect would not occur for a city like Kansas City because it already had teams and was not gaining one. But he observed: "If you were going to lose a team, you'd definitely have a loss." Nevertheless, to opponents of the stadium taxes, the referendum is not about keeping Kansas City major-league. Rather, it is about whether the burden of paying for sports teams' palaces should fall primarily on the public. – What would a Super Bowl or other national events be worth to a community? A lot, but probably not as much as they are touted. Jackson County proposes adding a rolling roof over Arrowhead, in part, to be able to possibly play host to a Super Bowl or a college basketball Final Four. But projections of local economic gains from such big-time national events are, again, a matter of great debate. For instance, studies for cities that had Super Bowls in the past decade predicted total consumer spending ranging from $290 million to $390 million, based on tens of thousands of visitors paying for hotels, restaurants, tickets and the like. Yet, in a review of such studies, Lake Forest College's Robert Baade and Williams College's Victor Matheson determined that Super Bowls delivered a fraction of the promised impacts, or an average of about $92 million, because local residents tended to stay away from the tourist hubbub. Now Kansas City has ventured into this muddle of money. Another study done for the Kansas City chamber by Development Strategies estimates a Super Bowl would deliver $142 million for Jackson County. And the same study estimates a Final Four would generate $270 million in economic activity "” far more than the $60 million that a different consultant found for the Kansas City Convention & Visitors Association. "I've been involved in Final Fours, and that $60 million figure is much closer to reality," said Rick Hughes, association president. Hughes said he believed the $202 million roof would be an incredible investment because of all the different events Kansas City could potentially hold. But even he agrees with something that economists like Michael Davis of the University of Missouri-Rolla assert: "The economic benefit of bringing a Super Bowl to the city is not anywhere near the cost of building the roof." To reach Jeffrey Spivak, civic affairs reporter, call (816) 234-4416 or send e-mail to jspivak@kcstar.com. |
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MVP Member |
Wonder if they are still eyeing the Hornets. Before Katrina hit, one of their writers said they could just take the Hornets from us by building the Sprint Center.
Yeah, bra, whatever you say. |
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OSC Record Holder |
Is it all about NO these days? We need to move on from that topic. |
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Senior Member |
Oh oh, now you will feel the wrath of twosome. |
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Volunteer Coordinator MVP Member |
Gee, I wonder why a guy who went back to NO to help rebuild his native community would harbor ill feelings towards a guy from SA? For what it's worth (nada), my advice is to just drop it. Two has been in here off and on for a long time. He actually helped out a lot during the salad days when SB5 passed, DC still had their heads in the sand, and we were briefly a frontrunner for the Expos. He goes over the line sometimes but he's passionate about sports, period. He is part of a small, vocal contingent of NO boosters on this site. So between them and the Portland fans, you have strolled into a lion's den. When others challenge your viewpoint, you are either dismissive or ignorant. So when you "incur the wrath of twosome" as you say, I can't say I'm surprised. |
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All-Star Member |
Amen TCL...
Why does SA or OKC want MLB or the NFL? Hee Haw might get preempted for a game telecast! Move on? Half the city of NO has no power and these ##$@s from Okiecity and SA (suck ---) are trying to take the teams like the people of NO didn't support them..Harvey Horney aka Astro, Two, and a few others who support Portland's effort and have linked this site as well as posted are getting it from all sides and you side with Alamoboy? Why is it when someone tells it like it is or talks about another subject than what you want it's shot to **** or locked? 1,381 posts against 76 and you take the dude from SA? Figures...Almost 7,000 posts and you never have my back either... Sickening.... And no....I haven't went PNB...I'm just sick of anyone who's ideas "don't matter" (in essense anyone not "important" who can't advance certain people's careers) get patted on the head, given a cookie and basically told to stand in the corner.... |
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OSC Record Holder |
Which time? If you don't know what's going on, or the reasonings behind something (which has happened before), it would be difficult for you to comment, would it not? Plain and simple... I don't care who touches who first. The need to escalate an emotional no-win conversation between residence of SA and NO has no value here. Both parties have been talked to. If the new guy doesn't get how things operate here, he'll get the gate. If Two doesn't understand, after I PMd him on how I'm approaching this matter, he has the option to walk. Others will need to let sleeping dogs lie, although given some history here, I have reservations as to whether that will happen. |
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All-Star Member |
Two can walk?
After his work on helping when SB5 was going on? Man...You really find out who's got your back...I guess I should walk too? |
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OSC Record Holder |
If there is an inability for anyone to keep from getting into tit-for-tat, ticky-tacky back and forths between members over issues that are hot button and have the ability to get overly emotional, then yes, people should head elsewhere. This shouldn't be a surprise, since we've had this policy for some time. |
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All-Star Member |
then yes, people should head elsewhere.
Just come right out and say it...You want Two and I to go the way of DM, PNB, Mavs, KC, etc. |
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OSC Record Holder |
No. The guidelines are simple. They have been in place for well over 3 years, and were put in place by OSC, not just I.
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MVP Member |
In my view, some of you guys need to do a better job of knowing who has your back and who doesn't. You simply cannot reason with everyone using the finer points of conversation.
Regards, |
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OSC Record Holder |
Yes they do. |
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Senior Member |
Maury, with all due respect, you are turning into the forum bully.
I know two. He can have a sharp tongue. But he proved his worth long ago by working on the SB5 revival when you were not around here. Shame on you for chastising some of your members in public. |
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OSC Record Holder |
Shame on me for keeping things from getting out of control. As I said... the policy is the policy and is no different now than it's been for years. As for not being here... when was that? |
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Senior Member |
I don't remember exactly when it was. It was after SB5 sank, but during the time it was revived. I think you had a previous engagement, and several of the board members carried the ball by emailing representatives and calling talk shows. Two was one of those who heavily participated. You were nowhere to be found. But in fairness to you, I think you were previously engaged with something else. As it is, I think you could be a bit more "tolerant" of those here who disagree with you. You have gotten to a point where whatever you says goes, as if you were the King around here or something. Even Mavsfan had to ask you if it was ok to post something here. It's gotten out of control. IMO, you need to take a step back. Maybe you could let some other people be the front-person for this outfit, while you work things behind the scenes. You could still be in charge in a more transparent way. I think people are shying away from posting because of your actions, but that's just my opinion. Personally, I don't have any problems with you, but I am just pointing out what I am seeing here since you are taking some of your own members to task. Remember, your site is only as good as your members. If you don't have any members left, you won't have much of a site. As it is, this board doesn't get much traffic anyway. By the way, self-deprication does not suit you very well. Quit trying to play the victim. Either you can take constructive criticism or you can't. I fear it is the latter. You always act like this when you are challenged from within the ranks. |
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OSC Record Holder |
I'm certainly willing to let anyone else run the forums here as long as the policy that OSC outlined is adhered to. In that sense, you're simply shooting the messenger.
The Sports Authority pays the bills to allow conversation here. As for playing the victim... please... it's a message board. One that, whether there are those that like it or not, has always had policy that isn't as wide open as other forums. I moderate differently here than on the Nationals Board at Ballpark Guys, so as I said... don't shoot the messenger. |
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All-Star Member |
It was after SB5 sank, but during the time it was revived. I think you had a previous engagement, and several of the board members carried the ball by emailing representatives and calling talk shows. Two was one of those who heavily participated. You were nowhere to be found. But in fairness to you, I think you were previously engaged with something else.
He's right as rain....Patrick, Cogan, and a few others were camped out on that Saturday that it passed calling talk shows and sending tons of letters.. As it is, I think you could be a bit more "tolerant" of those here who disagree with you. You have gotten to a point where whatever you says goes, as if you were the King around here or something. Seems like any idea not approved by Maury is taken to task or ignored...Model, etc. Some of us just enjoyed posting here....Now it's like a paid advertisement to people's other sites or a way for people to make themselves famous....Some of us know people inside the game but it doesn't mean we namedrop or belittle people who have no "insider" access.. Shooting the messanger is a martyr type posting...No one ever here was attacking you for rules... We were defending ourselves from your attacks...It seems there is a faction here that agrees with whatever you say, and there is a faction here who is just here for info and enjoyment.. This site is already a ghosttown....It's getting worse everyday. |
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OSC Record Holder |
Ah... yes, I was at the NWSABR meeting. The rest is certainly your opinion, and I respect that.
I'm certainly not using the OSC forums to become "famous", by the way. If making a couple hunderd bucks a year writing articles is "famous" it's being oversold. |
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Senior Member |
I think the "famous" reference could be how OSC helped make Craig M. (???? Whatever his name was!)
I think everyone needs to understand the time and emotional sweat this website and cause has taken on its individual contributers. Most, like myself, only add opinion pieces here, talk to friends and strangers, and go to the big events to support the cause (e.g., Grant High School meeting, SB5 Senate and House delibrations, volunteer work at PGE Park, etc.) The one percent on this site (Maury, Webmaster, etc.) are the ones who I will not disrespect their commitment. I will not vote in the stupid poll. I just sense alot of frustration (understandable) and people are taking it out on each other. BB |
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News Archivist MVP Member |
"This site is already a ghosttown....It's getting worse everyday."
It is kind of true, but there isn't any real news. San Antonio is making noise. As of today, I think it is more likely that whoever buys the Blazers/Rose Garden will bring in NHL. Man I want MLB, but the political climate in PDX is not good for ballpark funding now. My personal opinion is MLB is 3-5 years away. Do you think the NHL will stay away that long fro ma market with an NHL ready arena and 2.5 million people? "Baseball in Portland is an economic success story waiting to happen."-Governor Ted Kulongoski, from his letter to Bud Selig |
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News Archivist MVP Member |
You nailed it. People need to take a deep breath and relax. "Baseball in Portland is an economic success story waiting to happen."-Governor Ted Kulongoski, from his letter to Bud Selig |
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Senior Member |
Man, I would love to see that happen. I am not a Blazers' fan, but I do follow the NBA and have my team. But bringing the NHL here would be sweet. Maybe I could stop watching the Blackhawks on Center Ice! Nah, I'd still do it, but I'd love to see the game in town here. We need it given our winter climate and winter sports up in the mountains. If this turns into a good opportunity for Portland, I am behind it. Otherwise, Seattle could beat us out. Once and NHL team is sited in Seattle, it could become harder for us to get our own team. Emphasis on COULD. |
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Senior Member |
I am not sure about this comment. Each time I have been logging on lately, the count of members and non-members was like 2-6 and 4-10. Once there was something like 6-13. Can't remember the highest number of non-members but I thought "Man, what is happening?". If the term "ghost town" is used in the sense that nothing is happening in our town. Then yes we are in a dry spell every since Mr. Potter was a very ungracious host to the Marlins management. Sometimes when you play "hard to get", everyone passes you by. BB |
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